+354 – I previously made a post about this, but was deleted because I didn’t offer a clear solution. So here I am again to restart the conversation.
I think this is particularly important for Lighthouse, especially because of the way the spawns are setup. Since PMCs spawn so close to each other in this map, people often die very quickly in the first few minutes of the raid. As Tarkov likes to repopulate its servers this means that player scavs will spawn in as soon as these PMCs die. What makes this situation so dire is two things.
1. It takes time to properly clear the rogue area. This often leads to being pinned between rogues and player scavs within minutes of the raid. Especially when you are trying to do the tasks to plant stuff in the treatment area.
2. The player scav spawns can be right above the water treatment area. So they can even beat you to getting there if you don’t get a good spawn.
IMO scavs are for scavenging the map, and for scavenging the PMCs that decide to stick around to risk it.
I think a ten minute lock on raids would help fix issues like this (excluding factory).
What do you all think?
2022-08-05 14:50:39
[+354] |
My uninformed armchair game design opinion is that they could fix a big problem with scavs on Lighthouse specifically by removing the Industrial Zone Gates scav extract, or by making that the co-op extract instead of Side Tunnel.
It should just be half the raid timer. Whatever that is, then PScavs can spawn.
I main lighthouse and it’s impossible to avoid them, I go as fast as possible to try to mitigate it and there still are so many. I had the spawn on the mountain to snipe the rouges and by the time I can sprint down to loot my kills on building 2 there is already player scavs looting the rouges. I also had a raid where I went down to building 2 and was finishing two rouges left on the building, and there was a player sacv on the roof that killed me that was standing in between the rouges and they didn’t give a fuck.
My hypothesis is that player scavs fill up available slots in each raid so the servers don’t waste any space. Yes, there’s an overall issue with the playerbase rushing spawns and it’s extremely frustrating for pmcs who take the risk of bringing gear. But then, player scavs are typically ill equipped for rogue combat. The non-game changing approach for rogue farming would be finding a way to clear AI within the water plant, to be able to fully secure your kills. But I’m doubtful that most players would take that kinda risk due to meta rogue farming. Pros: you get easy rogue kills, Cons: Player scavs could beat you to securing the loot. I personally believe some of the AI should be reworked, less aimbot and more tactical movement.
This is how I feel on customs spawning in with more then 30 min left as a scav… Where the hell am I supposed to go and not die, end up seeing every damn pmc on the map… Or they see me more likely.
Anytime you see a player scav black out their leg, maybe both if you can. It makes it much harder for them to loot and more likely a different one will kill them. Killing a player scav just spawns more of them. Blacking out their leg removes the ability to get to loot quickly or chase fights and it doesn’t just spawn a second new player. Also increases the chance they don’t get to make it out of raid with free loot.
Arent scavs the local populace? Wouldnt it stand to reason that Scavs are gonna be there before PMCs, y’know cuz they like, live there and stuff?
The lock is great and ad others suggested scavs shouldn’t be able to choose thier map.
Yeah I think Ive seen that post. Something like scavs spawn too early. Pretty funny how mods allowed it for hours then removed it when it gained traction. Even tho the solution is almost self explanatory -> spawn them later. Guess one of scav main mods disliked your idea
Yeah, if you need a good example of this, run lighthouse. By the time I’m actually getting into the first cottages to loot from spawn, I’m running into player scavs, in just 5 mins from when I spawned.
Honestly I’d be ok with it being the last 10-20 minutes of a raid. Scavengers are there to…well…scavenge. And to me that implies slim pickings and just getting what we can get. Maybe get some loot off bodies other players couldn’t grab all of. Maybe some of them died to other NPC Scavs. Whatever it is we should be searching around looking for things that are of value to us. The goal, imo, for Scavs shouldn’t be to bee line it right to the rooms of most value but to always be on the search for things to loot.
Even though I don’t mind it I can see the flaws for most people. Scavs are more or less a “free run” where nothing is on the line and you have almost everything to gain, unless you die.
It also removes a lot of combat and interaction from Scavs and PMC as now PMCs would be forced to stay in the later half of a raid if they want to take advantage of the friendly extracts.
Not to mention Scav on Scav violence could be even more rampant without the worry of attracting PMC. Though I guess the amount of NPC Scavs alive might be drastically reduced by the later end of a raid unless they increased Scav count at the start/mid raid or they increased Scav spawn frequency in the later half.
At the same time I could see some positives. The lack of Scav players connecting in the start/mid of a raid *could* possibly help with some of the networking load. I don’t know nearly enough to have a confident opinion on that so I can only assume.
It would give some incentive for PMCs to stay later to meet up with Scav players, which would also funnel remaining PMCs; creating combat scenarios where maybe the PMC and Scavs who teamed up have to fight against the opposing, or even create player interactions where a group of PMC and Scavs team up at the end, of course with the lingering thought that anyone here could betray everyone at the last moment.
Just spit-balling ideas. I can definitely see the benefits in overall spreading out when Scav players spawn to be later and giving each “role” (PMC and Scav) their own environment to work in, in this case being at different times in the raid. As you said, those PMCs who stick around will gain all the interactions with Scav players both good and bad.
Well then how will the scav players get high end gear with 0 risk if they do that ? /s
I scav lighthouse a fuck ton, I love scaving, don’t ask me why. But I absolutely HATE when I get into a lighthouse raid with 36+ minutes left in the raid. I don’t want to be fighting PMCs with the majority of my kits like that and occasionally I actually get the sickest loot because the PMCs literally don’t have time to get there, yes the loot is cool, but tbh I shouldn’t be getting such quality as a scavvy boy. Spawn me in at 30 minutes and I’m a happy dude.
Here is where you’re wrong and so many others: Just because their name is “Scav” doesn’t mean they must live in scraps… A Scavenger may be well set up in his local area.
if you wanna get technical, in the Tarkov lore, the Scavs are all over the city while the PMC have to operate AROUND the scavs… meaning that scavs being at the start of the raid makes much more sense than spawning in 30 minutes late. Your entire idea behind scavs is flawed because you don’t understand this concept. They were NEVER meant to spawn at the end of a raid only it doesn’t make sense
Personally, I think Scav Time should take into account How much Line of Sight there is on the map. Maps like Lighthouse have massive areas which can cover most the map, while places like Customs or Woods have less of this. I think that the greater LOS someone can have on a map, the longer scans must wait to spawn in. Basically, scavs on sniping maps like lighthouse and reserve will spawn in later in raid than say Woods or Customs.
I think it should be 20
There shouldn’t be any predictable time for player scavs. It should be based off when X amount of PMCs die, so maybe once the 2nd or 3rd PMC in a raid dies, now the raid is open to player scavs.
I actually love being able to scav in early. As a PMC I like fighting player scavs and it fits with the lore that they can be there. As a scav it means you have a greater opportunity to get some decent loot.
Get good, player scavs are there to guarantee a minimum level of challenge to a raid by keeping in X players on it.
​
Maybe they could spawn in better places, but asking for ten minutes of free gameplay is asinine.
Disagree. P Scavs are an extra unknown element that adds to the difficulty. Scavs can be anywhere at anytime on the map, why shouldn’t players Scavs? Other than you don’t like it. It’s not unreasonable to believe a local would go check out the shots and engage the PMCs.
I’d argue that PScavs shouldn’t spawn before 10 minutes remaining on most maps… maybe 15 for big ones like Shoreline and Woods.
Why. I always spawn with 20 minutes left tops more like just 10 to 14 minutes. In Factory that’s not a problem but shoreline or interchange it sucks.
I disagree. Playerscavs should always be a threat.
Honestly I think scavs and pmc should spawn at the same time. I want chaos!
Sometimes I spawn with 9 minutes left on interchange.
Highly agree
I’m fine with player scavs spawning at any time.
BUT it should be an extremely low chance to spawn in earlier in the raid. With chances increasing as the raid timer counts down.
That way we can keep the random nature of scavs, but not have to worry about them spawning in within the first 2 mins.
If PScavs only spawned at halfway through a map’s lifespan, they’ll likely almost never see a PMC. And vice versa. I wish they spawned sooner if anything, and that’s as a guy who scav runs constantly as a free loot vacuum.
Couple this with not being able to choose your map.
In the games current state, day 1 of the wipe, you can scav lighthouse and kill a rogue leaving with class 5 armored rigs and a nice gun. Then roll into your PMC raid and you’re borderline invincible for the next 10-15 raids while you quest.
People should not be THAT enticed to play their scav character.
I thought it was already like this
There’s points on both sides, but the fact that scavs can spawn at train behind water treatment at the 37 minute mark is complete dumbfuckery.
IMO, BSG will probably not mitigate or do anything about early-raid player scav spawns.
As a lighthouse main, I believe there are ways to avoid getting pinned down by player scavs (especially if you are going for the Rogues like me on most Lighthouse raids).
TL;DR: Extract immediately if far from Rogues (RESET), find a faster yet efficient route, try night raids, and do not be greedy (time is a huge factor in clearing Rogues).
1) If you are far from the Rogues, RESET. Extract to Southern Road or, if you have RR, to Mountain Pass (maybe loot the chalets too for a little bit of roubles). The exfils of Lighthouse are easily accessible, so I would prefer to reset and deploy into another raid immediately than regret running to the looted and empty rogue plant from the other side of the map.
2) Find a quick and efficient route for the Rogues (there are a lot of decent routes in YouTube). Flee straight to the rogue plant when you spawn fairly near it and avoid the PMC spawns that could be in your way (or go against them). Also, investing in an SJ6 stim would help a lot especially if you are in one of the spawns nearest to the Rogues.
3) Night raids are an option. From experience, I have a higher success rate of clearing the Rogues and extracting on night raids compared to day raids. This might be because everyone in the lobby is most likely questing or heading to the new island safely. Also, I rarely encounter player scavs interrupting my route during night raids.
Although the most important lesson I learned when clearing the Rogues is to not be greedy. I would always prefer to eliminate only about 3-5 Rogues and clear and loot only one of the three buildings (whichever I am closest to). And plus, looting about 3 or more fairly kitted Rogues (excluding the other loose loot you will find) will make you extremely heavy which is a big downside especially when heading to exfil. Therefore, I believe being greedy and taking too much time in the rogue plant is just letting the other PMCs and player scavs catch up to you and ruin your raid.
I personally think 7 minutes just so that if you spawn as a scav you can immediately extrac without penalty
I’ve been hoping for this change for a while, maybe soon tm
I have had PMC-raids on Lighthouse where I barely move out of spawn before I start gunning down player scavs.
The lore says specifically for lighthouse it’s overrun with scavs